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Post by fanofe2 on Jul 31, 2016 19:03:30 GMT -5
I still want to know what the Keetster had against chickens.
Scooter was just ewwww.
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Post by kwdrewfan on Jul 10, 2017 21:09:47 GMT -5
Omg so the scene where Keetin & Annie are talking about all of Max's "deals" and "promises" to take certain teams to final 2...
Michelle: He's making checks his tush can't cash!
I NEVER NOTICED THAT SHE SAID THIS?? It struck me really funny for some reason, haha
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Post by kwdrewfan on Jul 10, 2017 21:44:05 GMT -5
Annie (after being eliminated): Good luck
Jenna: You too
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Post by kwdrewfan on Jul 10, 2017 22:47:55 GMT -5
TYLER'S COMMENTARY DURING "PATHFINDER" CRACKS ME UP SO MUCH! He sounds so confused and resigned the entire time. It's hilarious jdhdhjfk
"There's something obviously wrong with blue"
*blue pieces are literally scattered all over the board*
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Post by kwdrewfan on Jan 3, 2019 20:35:28 GMT -5
I just commented this on Youtube but thought I would share here as well:
Honestly, Tyler's logic for giving Green the samadhi instead of Brown or Purple (in Aqueduct) was some of the simplest yet smartest strategic thinking from anyone this season. It's a shame that he waited so late to actually try getting into the game, because he's obviously a good player as far as strategy. I would've liked to see him make some more moves throughout the competition.
Also, the older I get the more I see the appeal in the Purple team. I used to not be an Annie fan but I've warmed up to her on this last rewatch. Plus, she & Jeff were both awesome competitors and were actually quite the underdogs narratively.
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Post by e3hoohoo9 on Aug 6, 2019 11:50:57 GMT -5
--I really think Yellow could've won this mission. In fact, they, along with Purple, Red, and Brown could've won. But I wanted Yellow to win. --If Purple or Red won this mission, how much would've the game changed? I think if Yellow won, it would've been Blue and Gray going to Temple, and if Brown won, it would've been Purple and Gray going to Temple (Max mentions during the end of Face to Face that he wanted to send them at this point in time). However, if Purple or Red won, the game could've changed to a certain extent, although the loose alliance of Purple/Red/Orange/Gray wouldn't have survived past this episode (I'm certain that either one of those teams would've sent Orange with either Yellow or Brown, and Orange would go home). |
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Post by e3hoohoo9 on Aug 6, 2019 11:53:43 GMT -5
--This had to be the only time in Endurance history where there was a storm at Temple. Quite interesting, did you think the producers would try to make the contestants a bit safer? I remember the Red vs. Brown Temple from E3 definitely took place during a storm. |
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Post by amplify26 on Aug 17, 2019 14:25:43 GMT -5
--I really think Yellow could've won this mission. In fact, they, along with Purple, Red, and Brown could've won. But I wanted Yellow to win. --If Purple or Red won this mission, how much would've the game changed? I think if Yellow won, it would've been Blue and Gray going to Temple, and if Brown won, it would've been Purple and Gray going to Temple (Max mentions during the end of Face to Face that he wanted to send them at this point in time). However, if Purple or Red won, the game could've changed to a certain extent, although the loose alliance of Purple/Red/Orange/Gray wouldn't have survived past this episode (I'm certain that either one of those teams would've sent Orange with either Yellow or Brown, and Orange would go home). Why Blue, in particular? I know this is before the Annie/Calley beef began and alliances are just getting settled, but wouldn't they do the same thing as Green? As for Purple/Red winning, the alliance was too loose to function. |
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Post by fanofe2 on Aug 26, 2019 20:15:20 GMT -5
OMG. I totally forgot about the burros.
Mike and Keetin were such a fantastic team.
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Post by waterwoodfire on Aug 27, 2019 10:55:33 GMT -5
Given that Scooter was very outspoken about wanting Brown gone, Calley (who was perhaps Brown's biggest supporter), that would have made Blue a prime target
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Post by kwdrewfan on Jun 26, 2022 22:57:36 GMT -5
The whole Calley vs Annie thing was so weird. It was one of the biggest rivalries of the season (maybe of the show, even) yet it just seemed to come out of nowhere and was never really explained. It was like "I don't like because you don't like me" on both sides and I never figured out exactly WHY they didn't like each other I just rewatched E2 and like... hm. Maybe this is controversial of me but I have a theory re: the origin of the Calley/Annie rivalry. Obvious Disclaimer that this is only speculation, and I can't in any way claim to speak on behalf of any party involved here haha. These thoughts are based on nothing more than the final edit we were given.So Calley accuses Annie of having "low self esteem//which makes her feel the need to bully people", but when you actually look at Annie as a person... this doesn't really hold up. Annie is one of the most relaxed, outwardly confident players this season. She appears to be quite comfortable in her skin and unapologetic about who she is (good for Annie!). There is also no evidence of Annie being openly antagonistic toward Calley until after Calley's accusation, at which point we see both sides of that tension fleshed out a bit more. This could be due to missing footage, as in, maybe Annie WAS mean to Calley and we just didn't get to see it - but as an editor, if you're going to use this rivalry as a point of drama... it's kind of Editing 101 to provide some context for it. Calley's self-introduction in Episode 1 is, and I quote: "I'm scared to be here because I don't know anybody and they don't know me, so I'm worried some of us might not get along" - almost like she was already anticipating some sort of conflict to arise? She strikes me as someone who tends to be very bubbly and sensitive and emotional (I get it girl, me too), which as we know is NOT who Annie is. Like at all. It makes me wonder if Calley was going through some insecurity and social anxiety for herself, which she then projected onto Annie a bit. Maybe Calley became friends with the more talkative girls like herself (could be what Calley was used to in her daily life too), and in contrast, Annie's stoic personality made her feel threatened. Or rather, led her to believe that Annie didn't like her because she wasn't exhibiting any of Calley's benchmarks for a show of friendliness/friendship as she personally experiences it. Then it could have easily snowballed from there. Also since Keetin and Jenna were already good friends with Calley, it makes sense that they would side with her out of support because they didn't like to see her upset (even if they didn't have a problem with Annie otherwise). It feels to me like Calley somehow misinterpreted Annie's aloofness and complacency as outright hostility, which then made Keetin and Jenna rally alongside her because they knew Annie was the cause of their friend's anxiety (whether warranted or not). It makes me feel bad for Annie because she was just out there being herself and got saddled with the label of "bully" for no real reason... but Calley was also doing her best to navigate uncomfortable relationships with wildly unfamiliar people at age 15. Kind of a lose-lose scenario. |
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Post by Cruise meerkat Youssy on Jun 30, 2022 9:29:28 GMT -5
Omg what an amazing analysis and I think you’re totally spot on about that dynamic
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Post by amplify26 on Jul 5, 2022 19:56:00 GMT -5
The whole Calley vs Annie thing was so weird. It was one of the biggest rivalries of the season (maybe of the show, even) yet it just seemed to come out of nowhere and was never really explained. It was like "I don't like because you don't like me" on both sides and I never figured out exactly WHY they didn't like each other She strikes me as someone who tends to be very bubbly and sensitive and emotional (I get it girl, me too), which as we know is NOT who Annie is. Like at all. It makes me wonder if Calley was going through some insecurity and social anxiety for herself, which she then projected onto Annie a bit. Maybe Calley became friends with the more talkative girls like herself (could be what Calley was used to in her daily life too), and in contrast, Annie's stoic personality made her feel threatened. Or rather, led her to believe that Annie didn't like her because she wasn't exhibiting any of Calley's benchmarks for a show of friendliness/friendship as she personally experiences it. Then it could have easily snowballed from there. Also since Keetin and Jenna were already good friends with Calley, it makes sense that they would side with her out of support because they didn't like to see her upset (even if they didn't have a problem with Annie otherwise). It feels to me like Calley somehow misinterpreted Annie's aloofness and complacency as outright hostility, which then made Keetin and Jenna rally alongside her because they knew Annie was the cause of their friend's anxiety (whether warranted or not). It makes me feel bad for Annie because she was just out there being herself and got saddled with the label of "bully" for no real reason... but Calley was also doing her best to navigate uncomfortable relationships with wildly unfamiliar people at age 15. Kind of a lose-lose scenario. That's an interesting analysis of their conflict; I never thought of it that way. Though you did mention how there was little context about their rivalry prior to Tide Pull, so I only imagined that it would be an alliance-based thing. |
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Post by carsonvega on Jul 18, 2022 21:50:44 GMT -5
The whole Calley vs Annie thing was so weird. It was one of the biggest rivalries of the season (maybe of the show, even) yet it just seemed to come out of nowhere and was never really explained. It was like "I don't like because you don't like me" on both sides and I never figured out exactly WHY they didn't like each other I just rewatched E2 and like... hm. Maybe this is controversial of me but I have a theory re: the origin of the Calley/Annie rivalry. Obvious Disclaimer that this is only speculation, and I can't in any way claim to speak on behalf of any party involved here haha. These thoughts are based on nothing more than the final edit we were given.So Calley accuses Annie of having "low self esteem//which makes her feel the need to bully people", but when you actually look at Annie as a person... this doesn't really hold up. Annie is one of the most relaxed, outwardly confident players this season. She appears to be quite comfortable in her skin and unapologetic about who she is (good for Annie!). There is also no evidence of Annie being openly antagonistic toward Calley until after Calley's accusation, at which point we see both sides of that tension fleshed out a bit more. This could be due to missing footage, as in, maybe Annie WAS mean to Calley and we just didn't get to see it - but as an editor, if you're going to use this rivalry as a point of drama... it's kind of Editing 101 to provide some context for it. Calley's self-introduction in Episode 1 is, and I quote: "I'm scared to be here because I don't know anybody and they don't know me, so I'm worried some of us might not get along" - almost like she was already anticipating some sort of conflict to arise? She strikes me as someone who tends to be very bubbly and sensitive and emotional (I get it girl, me too), which as we know is NOT who Annie is. Like at all. It makes me wonder if Calley was going through some insecurity and social anxiety for herself, which she then projected onto Annie a bit. Maybe Calley became friends with the more talkative girls like herself (could be what Calley was used to in her daily life too), and in contrast, Annie's stoic personality made her feel threatened. Or rather, led her to believe that Annie didn't like her because she wasn't exhibiting any of Calley's benchmarks for a show of friendliness/friendship as she personally experiences it. Then it could have easily snowballed from there. Also since Keetin and Jenna were already good friends with Calley, it makes sense that they would side with her out of support because they didn't like to see her upset (even if they didn't have a problem with Annie otherwise). It feels to me like Calley somehow misinterpreted Annie's aloofness and complacency as outright hostility, which then made Keetin and Jenna rally alongside her because they knew Annie was the cause of their friend's anxiety (whether warranted or not). It makes me feel bad for Annie because she was just out there being herself and got saddled with the label of "bully" for no real reason... but Calley was also doing her best to navigate uncomfortable relationships with wildly unfamiliar people at age 15. Kind of a lose-lose scenario.
This is a really good analysis. Considering how much JD was willing to call players out when they actively made their alliances known or antagonized other teams (he called Nicole out in E3 for lying, he called Jenna out in E2 for hugging only Yellow and Green after Brown won On the Ropes, he mentioned more than once after it initially happened that Shea and John had revealed their Blue-Gray alliance in E4, etc.)...I think it would have been quite likely that he would have addressed Annie specifically if she had actively done something against Calley before Calley's low-self-esteem accusation. After the accusation, the camera focused on Annie for a few seconds, but JD didn't ask Annie about it. While ignoring/shunning someone can be hurtful, there's a fine line between that and just not talking to someone very much, and that kind of thing is hard to "police".
From Annie's perspective, I could understand not wanting to talk to Calley that much just in terms of gameplay. In the Fireball episode, when Jeff and Annie were weighing the pros and cons of giving each team the Samadhi, they specifically noted that Yellow would come after them if they gave the Samadhi to Brown. Brown was definitely a big threat, and I think it could have been frustrating for Purple knowing that Brown was a threat but not being able to move against Brown as early as they wanted to because of Yellow. I play a lot of board games, including ones that are primarily social or with a social component, and I will freely admit that when I try to convince another player of a strategy and they seem set against it for what I consider to be bad reasons, I will sometimes start to ignore that player and try to work with other players. (Maybe not the nicest thing to do, and maybe not always the best in terms of my gameplay, but I think it's better than trying to undermine that player.) I think Annie's in-Endurance relationship with Calley may have had some similarities to this.
One other factor which I think was in play in this situation was what everyone was thinking about the season of Endurance they had just seen, E1...where Sabrina manipulated Aaron. I think there was maybe a greater wariness than there might usually have been about girls talking to boys who were not their teammates. Annie herself noted that Jacquelynn seemed to agree with every boy she talked to before the partner selection. And at the time of the low-self-esteem accusation, it was clear that Annie was talking to a lot of the boys...making it that much more obvious that she wasn't talking with Calley. In fairness to Calley, Keetin mentioned how she didn't like that Mike didn't want to move against Annie, and in the On the Ropes episode, Jenna knew that Max wasn't a big fan of targeting Purple to go to the temple at least in part because of Annie, but she told Max that Mike had told her that Annie said Green was going to be safe if Purple had won On the Ropes.
In the end, I do think you are right that Annie avoided Calley and Calley thought that that was meaner than Annie really intended it to be.
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Post by amplify26 on May 29, 2023 22:57:24 GMT -5
She strikes me as someone who tends to be very bubbly and sensitive and emotional (I get it girl, me too), which as we know is NOT who Annie is. Like at all. It makes me wonder if Calley was going through some insecurity and social anxiety for herself, which she then projected onto Annie a bit. Maybe Calley became friends with the more talkative girls like herself (could be what Calley was used to in her daily life too), and in contrast, Annie's stoic personality made her feel threatened. Or rather, led her to believe that Annie didn't like her because she wasn't exhibiting any of Calley's benchmarks for a show of friendliness/friendship as she personally experiences it. Then it could have easily snowballed from there. Also since Keetin and Jenna were already good friends with Calley, it makes sense that they would side with her out of support because they didn't like to see her upset (even if they didn't have a problem with Annie otherwise). It feels to me like Calley somehow misinterpreted Annie's aloofness and complacency as outright hostility, which then made Keetin and Jenna rally alongside her because they knew Annie was the cause of their friend's anxiety (whether warranted or not). It makes me feel bad for Annie because she was just out there being herself and got saddled with the label of "bully" for no real reason... but Calley was also doing her best to navigate uncomfortable relationships with wildly unfamiliar people at age 15. Kind of a lose-lose scenario. That's an interesting analysis of their conflict; I never thought of it that way. Though you did mention how there was little context about their rivalry prior to Tide Pull, so I only imagined that it would be an alliance-based thing. Going back to your comment, there's a part in Rollerball in which Annie claims that, "If [Keetin] was nice to me and said, 'Hi, Annie', I would be like 'Whatever, hi', but she hasn't done that--it takes two". It stands out to me because it almost makes me feel like Annie was a lone wolf in a way, and the girls felt threatened by how strong she was. Though it never gets as personal as with Lindi/Nicole/Sarah vs. Bryanah, it has some shades of that when the girls try to persuade their partners to take Purple out. While I'm not trying to put blame on anybody, it's curious how Jenna/Keetin/Calley form their own clique, with the latter being the most outspoken of the three. Calley also intrigues me because she might have been the one to never go on an airplane before E2 (has this been verified?), so her social group could be vastly different from what we have here. Also, doesn't this make Purple the "underdog" here--at least in terms of social strategy? |
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Post by carsonvega on May 31, 2023 0:33:23 GMT -5
Also, doesn't this make Purple the "underdog" here--at least in terms of social strategy?
There is a lot of subjectivity in terms of how the relative strength of teams can be compared at any given time in a season of Endurance. Though not everything is better with an objective standard, in my mind the standard of whether a team is an underdog or not is that team being targeted with negative events at least 3 times - getting the Samadhi which includes the E3 pieces steal and the E5 partner switch, getting sent to the temple EXCEPT at final 3 because there is no choice about who goes to the temple after a team wins the final temple mission, and getting an undesired partner when the majority of the other players get their desired partners. So by this standard, the underdogs are:
E1 Orange (partnership was not on the list though we were not shown that they disliked each other, got 2 samadhis and was sent to temple twice before F3) E1 Green (undesired partnership, got sent to temple three times before F3) E2 Orange (got 1 samadhi and was sent to temple twice before F3) E2 Brown (got 1 samadhi and was sent to temple twice before F3) E3 Yellow (undesired partnership initially, got 4 samadhis and was sent to temple twice before F3) E4 Red (got 2 samadhis and was sent to temple twice before F3) E5 Gray (got the partner switch samadhi, one other samadhi, and was sent to temple before F3)
E5 Blue (got the partner switch samadhi and was sent to temple three times before F3) E6 Yellow (undesired partnership, got 1 samadhi and was sent to temple before F3, though them getting sent to temple was the direct impact of the samadhi twist) E6 Purple (got 1 samadhi and was sent to temple twice before F3)
The standard I came up with is not perfect. E5 Gray and E6 Yellow weren't really around long enough to feel like an underdog and one might almost say the same thing about E6 Purple. E2 Brown had a lot of power for a few episodes so it can be hard to think of them as an underdog, though I do think the edit ended up emphasizing that they had to fight through adversity to get their win.
With that said, it does feel right to me that E2 Purple is not an underdog, with only 2 temple trips and no samadhi (less adversity than either E2 Orange or E2 Brown faced). Though they were not in the Brown-Green-Yellow alliance, their social ability (both Jeff and Annie talking to Mike) saved them from going to temple when Orange and Red went (at least as far as the edit showed). Their social ability also may have played a role in them not getting the samadhi (Tyler throwing it out) at final 4. Also by this standard, E4 Purple is not an underdog, as yes they had an undesired partnership initially but were never given a samadhi and got sent to temple only once before F3 (and even that one time was due to them not doing well in the Waterworks mission rather than being targeted by any other team). E4 Purple not being an underdog feels at least somewhat fair to me, since their closest alliance controlled the game until the F3 and E4 Green never targeted them with anything.
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